MGB - Ignition Complete

My last couple of posts have spanned 3 weeks, and, honestly, most of the work has as well. Today's post ends with a running car, and covers the final step in the ignition journey.

 

Best Laid Plans

I thought my plan was so simple. I would just pull out a box of bolt-in ignition parts and I would go from a running-crummy car to a magical sled. As you have witnessed from the last couple of posts, it was not that simple. First, the battery was dead, then the fuel pump was bad. Now, we are finally ready to set the timing, but there doesn't appear to be any spark coming from this new ignition. Why?

Lucas, Lord of Darkness

First, that's not my joke; I borrowed it from Hal. Thanks, Hal. Years later, its still funny, and in so many cases, its still true.

Lucas CEI ignition wiring diagram

I figured that the red and black wires for the ignition signal in the new distributor could just re-use the red and black wires that had been feeding the old distributor. That was my mistake, because I did not recognize this was not your standard distributor. No... this was a Lucas CEI ignition system. While I imagine these were great in their day, this set up was a little more complicated. The 2-wire signal going to/from the distributor does not go directly to the coil. It routes through an amplifier box. This amplifier box appears to only work with the Lucas stuff, though. I believe that either the replacement hi-power coil, the new distributor or both are not compatible with the amplifier box.

The amplifier does not make things much more complicated: it only adds 2 wires to the coil, but the wiring around the coil is already a little confusing. Add in some extras and some grease shmears and trying to figure out what wire is for what starts to get more difficult, especially when the wires are not in the standard diagram. The image above is correct, but it is not in the standard "advance autowire" wiring diagrams, nor can I find references to the Lucas CEI in the MGB shop manual that I have. Still, this research did tell me that there is no ballast in the circuit from the coil to the distributor. There is a ballast between the coil and the fusebox (and that remained), but I figured I should be able to direct-wire the red/black wires to the +/- on the coil directly. The picture below should help show what a "ballast" coil set up looks like. See that "distributor resistor" in the drawing below? It is not in the drawing above so I don't have that. So, we start over. Kinda.

 

Final Install

standard 1978 ignition wiring diagram

I started by removing the distributor again. I had moved the 2-pin plug from the Lucas distributor onto the AccuSpark so I undid those solder joints and soldered on 2 1-foot lengths of 16ga wire (black and red for negative and positive, respectively). I heat-shrink'd the solder points. To the ends of these wires, I added female wire disconnects and heat-shrink'd those as well.

Next, I disconnected the wires going to and from the amplifier box and then removed the box itself. I re-installed the coil and the 2 things that shared the mount-points with 2 shorter bolts. Then, I slid the distributor back in, and re-set the mounting bolt to hold it firm. I had found TDC earlier, as noted in my previous post, so I oriented the distributor visually into the same place (took a picture before removing). In theory, everything should be fairly well set, at least well enough to start, albeit roughly. I optimistically pulled out my timing light just in case.

On an aside, the MGB battery is behind the passenger seat. This makes use of a timing light challenging. To remedy, I sat an old battery on the floor by the front bumper on the passenger side and clipped my positive and negative leads for the timing light onto it. 

It's Alive!

tidied up

I double-checked my under-hood connections, turned off the KBOO and then returned to the driver seat. I turned the key to run and heard the click-then-hum of the fuel pump as well as a click from the engine compartment. Thinking that was the coil leaping to life, I turned the key to start and Oliver started immediately. I mean immediately. No ba-ba-ba beforehand, no choke needed. He just started, and then dropped into a lope-y idle.

Setting Timing

Thrilled, I clipped my timing light sensor on spark lead #1 and pointed it at the main pulley. It flashed on the timing mark, indicating I was around 10* before top dead center (BTDC), which was in the ballpark (suggested 6-14 degrees advanced from TDC by AccuSpark). I tried rotating the distributor housing a little bit to advance or retard the timing, and found that Oliver was most content around 12* BTDC. My light is a cheapy, and does not have a knob to check full advance. So, instead, I used my ears, revving the engine up and down and then revving it up and quick-pulling my foot off the pedal. This last test was when Oliver used to backfire. There was none of that now. Of course, he is not under load right now either. Undeterred, I went back up front and checked his timing again: he was still settled at 12*.

I turned off Oliver's engine and tightened down the timing adjust set bolt (5/16") so the distributor would not rotate on it's own, and his timing would be locked in. I was done. Wow. I hadn't expected that. So, I spent a few minutes cleaning up some of the wiring that I had earlier cut loose from the taped loom by encasing it in some basic wire wrap.

leads now

I included the before picture of my ignition below (blue leads) and a picture of the ignition now on the right here (red/orange leads), taken from about the same spot. If you look closely, you will notice that the newly installed distributor is oriented at least 45* anti-clockwise compared to how it was before. So, either I had moved the dizzy a little before taking that before picture or the engine was running so incredibly off it is kind of a miracle it was running at all. Perhaps the backfires on deceleration could be attributed to the timing being so far off that the dizzy could not get back to a fire-at-the-right-time state when I took my foot off the pedal.

At this point, I'm not sure it was ever firing at the right time. Based on how quickly he started, and how well he ran after I revved him a few times, I am confident the mark I used for TDC and his timing are correct. The lesson here, I think, is to give your new-to-you car a tune-up as soon after you get it home as you can. I have been given this lesson before (See Bay City Blues), but I guess I need multiple examples before I learn sometimes. Bare minimum, I will start looking at my spark plugs during oil changes so I have a regular insight into the combustion. Might be worth a quick validation of the timing when I do that.

Next?

Oliver is pretty much ready to go again. He hard-started a few days after I did the timing I mentioned above. So, I still need some carb adjustment time, and he needs to go through DEQ, of course. An oil change is overdue as well. Otherwise, he is practically ready for Summer. As am I. Just thinking about a top-down drive with Boo for a picnic at a park sounds just about perfect. I'll post on the carb tuning when I get to it.

leads before

I'm not sure what I will be working on next, but nice weather is right around the corner so returning to the paint on Zed is inevitable. Some of him sat outside all winter, so I imagine there is quite a bit of rework coming before I can think about laying paint. Meanwhile, T is due back in the Pacific NorthWest to fight forest fires somewhat soon, and he will probably want/need Nemo on his off days. So, maybe I need to get that rear end sorted. Of course, Nemo won't start now or even put a signal to the OBD2 plug, so he is going from bad to worse fast.

Regardless, there's always something to do at ShadeTree, like helping a local kid swap out his muffler. Oops, I guess I forgot to post on that. We had fun and he learned something: a fart can muffler on an otherwise stock exhaust doesn't really do anything. For a meaningful change in tone and performance, he will need to remove at least one of the other resonators. He is saving up for a cat-back; that will be fun.

Thanks, as always, for following along.

MGB - Electronic Ignition

It was an unseasonably cold weekend recently. Since Oliver is in a nice warm-ish garage and Spring is supposed to be here now, I decided that I would start getting Oliver (1978 MGB) convertible-top-down, road-ready. Today's post starts us off with replacing the ignition. Like so many things with these old cars, nothing is as simple as it seems on it's surface, so this post ends without a running car. Maybe I'll get it next time. 

AccuSpark

Most folks think of "Pertronix" when they think of an electronic ignition upgrade. PerTronix makes great electronic ignition systems, for sure. I ran one on the old bus engine for a little while. I decided I would try the AccuSpark system because it was less expensive and appeared to be UK-based. The UK-based nature had me thinking that maybe it was better suited to an English motor. So, back in the Fall 2019 when I was thinking that I would be spending the winter finishing Oliver, I bought one of their kits, and put it on a shelf. Things happened, CoViD-19 blew up, the wiring in Hapy got complicated and I forgot about it... until I was cleaning my garage and found the box with the international shipping labels still attached. Jeez.

For around 70 pounds plus postage, you can order a drop-in ignition. When I did it, it ran me about $150US including shipping to the States. So, what's in the box?

- a pre-fitted electronic ignition in a 45D distributor (correct dizzy for a rubber-bumper / later model MGB)

- a distributor cap

- 4 Champion AC9C 3-prong spark plugs

- a blue ballast coil (though you can upgrade to a "Viper Dry" coil)

- a set of spark plug leads ("wires" to US folks) with a di-electric grease pouch

- you can optionally include a timing light

Preparation

It is recommended that you set your engine to top dead center (TDC) or firing position for the #1 cylinder. For most cars, the distributor could go in multiple ways, so making sure it is oriented correctly requires that you know which cylinder is ready to fire. The MGB engine is unusual in that it has a one-way-only key in the distributor drive and corresponding gear in the engine. If you try to put it in any other way it will not seat and not turn. Still, I wanted to make sure I had clear timing marks so I got a 1-15/16" socket for my 1/2" ratchet, removed the air-directing tin between the front of the engine and the rear of the radiator and turned the engine (clock-wise) until I could see the little nick on the rear of the main pulley. I aligned it with the top-most saw-tooth on the timing meter and then marked both with a dot of yellow paint. I also marked the tooth representing 15* advanced, since that is the stock amount of advance desired at idle (per the Bentley manual). This mark later turned out to be incorrect.

 

To find true TDC, I had to pull the valve cover and watch the valves move while I rotated the engine with the 1/2" ratchet. The mark that I believed was TDC was about 90* off. I found a different mark on the front (front is front) of the main pulley that was around midway between the points where the intake/exhaust valves opened. Accepting that this was the true TDC, I marked the nick with a dot of yellow.

With the replacement kit and tools on a nearby table, and the radio playing the Saturday morning KBOO shows, I was now ready for some ignition fun.

Spark Plug Remove and Inspect

My old ignition basically had not been looked at since I bought this car. Since Oliver has not had more than a couple hundred miles on him, clearly I did not drive his old system into it's current state. Frankly, it sat for a few years before I bought him, and without any servicing since, my expectation was that it needed, well... a lot. His performance had not been all that great when I bought him, and the new exhaust did not create the pick-me-up I had hoped for. So, away we go.

I started with removing the old spark plugs with a 13/16" socket. Spark plugs are a great gauge for how well your combustion has been performing: too rich, too lean, oily, too hot, etc. My findings were mixed, and odd. From firewall to fan, Plugs 4 and 3 were black, but dry, indicating that they had been burning inefficiently. Plug number 2 was black as well, but had some soot on it. Plug number 1 had a little bit of soot around the edge, but the prong was grey. So, I look at my plugs and compared them to the AutoLite Plug diagram (image posted here) to try to figure out what's going on.

Based on the mapping document here, numbers 3 and 4 are "carbon fouled", with lots of possible causes, ranging from "wrong plug" to weak ignition to mis-tuned carb, too-gentle driving or a bad choke. Neat, but at least they look like twins. I am more concerned about plugs from 1 and 2. These are fed by the same intake runner, yet they look very different. Plug 2 looks like a worse version of plugs 3 & 4, and plug 1 has a clean or normal looking ground electrode with some carbon around the edge.

L-to-R: plugs 4 to 1

These plugs may have been wrong for the engine. Spark plugs are a religion, and I have followed a relatively simple rule (that will probably frustrate / anger / enflame some people): I align the plug manufacturer country with the engine/car manufacturer country. So, I'll find NGK's for our Subaru, Bosch for Audi/VW's and Champions for US/English cars. The plugs I pulled out are single-prong NGK's; to be fair, NGK may make a perfect plug for the MG. I don't know. I can say that the AccuSpark folks (from the UK) sent me 4 Champion AC9C 3-prong plugs. MAybe they subscribe to the same flavor of spark plug religion that I do. I don't expect the plugs were the problem, but they may have been a contributor. Regardless, I gapped (0.035" per the Bentley manual) the three prongs on each plug and then installed the delivered-with-the-kit spark plugs.

Dizzy Swap

With the plugs done, I pulled the distributor cap and the lead from the coil. This created some access to the distributor mounting bolts. The prior owner installed a remote inverted oil filter unit, so the access to the front mount bolt was still a little challenging, but not impossible. Still, a little fun with an old-skool 7/16" spanner got the bolts out. Once the bolts were removed, the dizzy popped right out. I immediately settled it back in, and made a mark in the dust on the starter cover which direction the rotor was pointing. As I said above, the dizzy can only go in one way, so whichever way the rotor is pointing when you pull the cap is the only way it could be pointing. In the images I have seen on the internet, the number 1 plug is usually in the 1 o'clock position, but that is not always the case. Sometimes the dizzy gear is put in upside down so your #1 plug position is actually on the bottom. When I rotated the engine, the cap was on, and the leads had not been touched. I noted at this point, though, that the distributor rotor was pointing down and slightly to the left. When I removed the cap, the #1 lead was in that area, so I figured I would put it back together the same way. If things were 180* off, it will run, but poorly. Re-setting the leads 180* the other way would be easy to test later. I took the picture below so I could run the replacement leads the same way as they were.

old leads

With the old dizzy off, I loosened the clamp on the new one so it would move a little bit. The timing of the old set up might have been off, based on the "carboned" color of the plugs. Regardless, I want to be able to change it from the shipped-to-me state. I will clamp it tight (5/16" wrench) once the timing is verified. Satisfied that the dizzy would turn in the clamp, but only with some effort, I popped the new dizzy into place. The new mounting plate only had a single bolt hole for mounting, above and to the left, but otherwise, install was trivial. The lower bolt was the hard one to get to, so I was not going to complain. I put the now-extra bolt into the lower right hole anyway and snugged them both down tight.

Coil

The kit delivered with a new coil that corresponds to whether there is a ballast in your system. The electronics require the more powerful coil. Swapping a coil is easier than swapping a distributor, usually. In this case, because so many things leverage the mounting bolts for a ground, it is more of a juggling act than the coil swap in the old bus. I unmounted the original, and set it upright on the starter, leaving the wires attached to the various tabs. This gave me room to install the new coil and remain focused on the grounds and such. Once in place, I moved the female wire-disconnect-tipped wires from old coil to new coil.

Cap and Leads

The hard part, if you want to call it that, was over. Now, it was a simple matter of installing the leads. The prior set-up had the #1 lead around 7 o'clock. From there, they run the same way on all MG's: 1-3-4-2 anti-clockwise. The set of leads delivered with a clear dielectric grease, which is recommended on the electric connection to prevent corrosion and encourage a better current delivery. I smeared some on each end of all connections and plugged things in nice and snug. The electric connector floated around in the spark plug boot end a little bit so I made extra-sure the encased metal spark-plug end was definitely snapped on.

At this point, I would have started the engine and set the timing. Unfortunately, the turn of the key resulted in nothing. No noises, no clicks and definitely not starting. A quick glance at the voltmeter told me all I needed to know: flat battery. Awesome. So, this post got kinda long, and the resulting diagnostic did as well. So, I'll get back to Oliver next time. Thanks, as always, for following along--

Oh SNAP

A couple of weeks ago, I had the $500 Jetta suddenly stall in the driveway. Today's post covers the root cause investigation.

P0341: cam position sensor
P0422: o2 sensor

Stall

So, Boo is standing in the driveway next to her idling 2001 VW Jetta (named 2dot0) when it suddenly stopped running. There was no special noise, nor did it gasp on it's way down. It was just running one second and not running the next. My mind ran through a few scenarios, but I landed on electrical because of how quickly it shut off.

What You Should Do

Since a gas engine runs with the correct combination of fuel, air, compression and spark, These are the things that should be checked, and checked in that order, before you start swapping parts... even if you think you're sure you know what's wrong. If you have a more modern car, get a code reader and pull the codes from the computer. Sometimes, the computer won't give you a code for a while. I didn't get these codes here until after I'd figured out what was wrong through the steps below. The P0341 code confirmed my findings.

Fuel

fuel pressure regulators
(new on right)

Simply put, verify that you have fuel at the injector. To radically simplify things, I verified that I had fuel at the fuel pressure regulator by removing the regulator and letting the fuel pump cycle. I had fuel bubbling over. Pulling an injector can be difficult, so for me, this demonstrated that I had fuel at the rail. The probability of all 4 injectors clogging so badly that the fuel wasn't making it to the chamber was so low, I ruled out fuel, but replaced the fuel pressure regulator anyway since the old one fell apart on extraction (see picture).

Air

Check the air filter. It is completely clogged? It's probably not the issue. Check the "snow snorkel" that runs from the air box to the outside. Sometimes something can get jammed in there (like snow), preventing the engine from getting air. Remove some intake piping between the air box and the metal bits so you can see the little gate on the air intake. When the foot pedal is moved, does the flap move? You're probably getting air. This would be a good time to check the air sensor. This usually would throw a code, but to verify it isn't that sensor, unplug it and try to start the car. If it starts, that sensor is bad. The car will run without the sensor, but badly. Sometimes this sensor can prevent a start, but that wasn't the case with me. I ruled out air, and put everything back together again.

This is where I should have checked compression, but I was convinced it was an electrical thing, so I skipped ahead to Spark. Don't. Checking your compression is easy, and it reveals some very interesting info about your upper end, the mechanical timing and, possibly, a lower end issue.

Compression

2.0 ignition coil

Grab your compression tester (they are pretty cheap, if you don't have one) and test your cylinders one at a time. It's best to remove all four plugs, and test each cylinder multiple times. Take care how you manage your plugs and wires so you don't set yourself or your car on fire nor do you lose track of which wire goes where. Unplugging the coil is the simple solution. Anyway, if you get any reading under 100psi, try squirting a little oil into the cylinder and retest. If the reading is better, your rings are going and you'll need a bottom end rebuild soon. Start saving. If the reading doesn't change, its a valve-train issue. Assuming all of your reading are within 15% of each other and they are all above 100psi, move on to fuel.

Had I done this step before Spark, I would have found all 4 cylinders at 0 PSI, indicating a broken timing belt. This was verified by removing the timing belt cover and not seeing the belt. Yikes.

Spark

Remove the spark plug that's easiest to get to. In the 2.0 engine, that's #4. Take care how you remove the plug wire. Now, with a partner turning the key, hold the plug against the engine block (forming a ground) and watch for the spark. No spark? Could be your issue. I was way overdue for a tune up, and the plug socket fell off the plug wire when I touched it, so I concluded replacing plugs and wires was a good idea. 2dot0 still didn't start. I should already have checked compression, but still, I should have stopped here and gone back to it. I continued down the electrical gremlin path instead.

The new plugs and wires didn't do it. So, I got a new coil. And then a new battery. And finally a new crank position sensor. Still no start.

Realizations

no, I'm not a Packer fan

It wasn't until I got to this point that I reverted to the compression tests and learned that I had just thrown over $100 of new parts plus a battery into a large boat anchor. The timing belt broke, throwing off the timing and causing the valves to hit the piston tops. The engine was effectively blown. Tiny fragments of valve and piston will work their way into the deeper recesses of the engine while the breaking belt could have damaged rollers or the coolant pump. I sold the car for scrap and its gone.

Watching 2dot0 get towed away, I ran a quick accounting. I bought the car for $500, and had it running for another $30. Since then, I only bought tires and oil, so that's probably another $600 or so. Rounding up, I was probably into that car for $1200 before it broke and then threw another $300 into it. That's $1500 for a car including maintenance for 18 months minus the salvage I was paid, means it cost me less than $70/mo. Since you can barely rent a car for a weekend at that rate, I think we did extremely well. I just wish I had performed the timing belt maintenance.

That's all for today. After 2dot0 broke, I served my penance for not doing the timing belt by riding mass transit for a few weeks. Today was my first day back driving to work. It is such a luxury, though I do kind of miss the light rail. Thanks for following along-

Bay City Blues

After the Timothy Lake camping trip, we felt pretty confident in our new little camper, and planned another trip right away. Three weeks after driving up Mt. Hood, we planned a trip to Cape Mears State Park. We had heard that there were interesting birds and other wildlife there, and the park wasn't as crowded as the Cape Lookout State Park just south of there. I followed the old axciom of "if it ain't broke, don't mess with it" approach to preparing Hapy for the trip. I continued to drive him to work every day, and he performed great. When the day to leave arrived, we loaded Hapy with all the usual camping stuff for a Summer weekend on the Oregon Coast (so we brought plenty of warm clothes) and hit the highway.
We took Interstate 5 to OR217 to US26 - our usual route when we drove other cars. We hadn't driven as far as Hillsboro before Hapy started some odd misfires. I verbally wrote it off as bad gas or the engine being cold to my wife, but I started obsessing about it. Thoughts of "I shoulda done a full tuneup" started crowding into my mind. Everyone else was enjoying the view out the windows while I listened to the occasional misfire and grimaced. The Coast Range passed and we could start to smell the ocean when Hapy started to really fail. I had to finally pull over on a straight stretch of road to see what was going on. Hapy died as I pulled to the shoulder, and the feelings of anger and disappointment started to really take hold. On top of that, I had to appear on top of things for my 2 very young kids who knew right away something was not quite right.
I popped the engine door and looked around. Nothing looked wrong. I checked the hoses and plug wires. Everything looked normal, but felt pretty warm. I tried the old oil dipstick test (if you can touch the oil without it hurting, you're not too hot), and it was HOT. Drat. I checked the fuel filter, even changed it, but that didn't do anything. I resolved to let the engine cool and then try to get us to our destination, but my wife was not too hip for that. The passing semi-trucks were making us both rather nervous, so we were hoping the bus would cool off fast. Luck smiled on us in the form of a passing unencumbered tow-truck heading into Tillamook - same as us.
The tow truck driver told us we were about 10 miles from Tillamook, and that he knew an old VW mechanic in the next town north: Bay City. Although I wanted to wait out the cooling engine, I knew the kids weren't safe on that narrow shoulder with the passing trucks. I knew we needed to go this route; knowing our camping trip was effectively over before it began. We all pilled into the tow truck (it had a crew cab if you can believe it), put Hapy up on the platform and drove to Bay City.
Now, if you've never been to Bay City, it doesn't have a traffic light, nor any kind of downtown, but there is a mechanic that knows air-cooled Volkswagens: Klingelhofer Auto Repair. Crazy. The name even sounded old-country. By the time we got to his shop, which was also his home, it was getting late in the afternoon, and he couldn't get to it right away. He had the tow truck driver drop the bus near the garage and then we all had a beer. Yeah, that's right. Me, the tow truck driver and the mechanic. Klingelhofer said we were more than welcome to "camp" in his driveway, and pointed out where the ocean was from his place. It turned out to be about 300 feet from his driveway, so while he fixed the bus on Saturday, we walked the Bay City beach/coast line. Because of time delays, we were unable to leave Satruday night before we lost our camping reservation, so we spent Saturday night at Klingelhofer's too. We had a big ol' barbeque with a bunch of his friends, rode around on his quad and played Frisbee.
Before we left on Sunday, we settled the bill, and he explained that the coil had gone bad. This explained the weird misfires, and really couldn't have been diagnosed until it finally died. When a coil fails, it doesn't always give you a warning, so its a good idea to carry a spare. When it starts acting funny, swapping a new coil takes 5 minutes, and you're on the road again. The alternative is getting towed to a garage and camping in their parking lot for the weekend. Considering our experience, though, that alternative wasn't really that all bad. In fact, it was kinda fun.
Until next time--